Equity Rising S1 : Episode 10
Bonus Episode: Black in a White Sport
An Extended Chime In with J’Lynn Matthews, Colton Green, and Austin Hegmon
In this special bonus episode, we bring you the voices of three athletes in Ultimate Frisbee. Jay, Colton, and Austin generously provide us with a window into the life of a POC athlete in a sport steeped in white culture. Through the specificity of each of their stories, we were reminded that the project of equity is one that permeates every aspect of our lives. Whether you’re on the field or in the boardroom, we’re sure you’ll relate to the issues these young athletes describe: the codification of white professionalism, performative wokeness, and the untrained biases that are so painfully ingrained in our culture. In their thoughtful and loving critiques of Ultimate Frisbee culture, all three athletes give us reason to be hopeful about the shifting tides within athletics and beyond.
This episode was produced by Lili Gu & Julia Drachman and edited by Josh Berl.
Transcript
Jay Matthews 0:00
Anybody else wants to start?
Lili Gu 0:05
What you're hearing is a call that took place in early January 2021 among three young athletes who play Ultimate Frisbee. In our last episode, we spoke with Shanye Crawford about equity in the sport of ultimate. So we thought it would be interesting to dig a little deeper with some more players who have experienced the ups and downs of being locked in a predominantly white sport. You'll be hearing from three athletes. There's Austin Hegmon.
Austin Hegmon 0:30
He and his pronouns, super super senior, at Georgia State, play for Georgia State Underground.
Lili Gu 0:37
There's Jay Matthews.
Jay Matthews 0:38
I go by Jay in the ultimate community. The only people are calling me J'Lynn are like my close friends. Currently a junior at Temple University in Philadelphia.
Lili Gu 0:47
And then Colton Green.
Colton Green 0:48
I am from Dallas, currently with the Dallas Roughnecks, and I'm also on the association's DEI board.
Lili Gu 0:56
I'm Lili Gu, and I'm a volunteer producer on the Equity Rising team. And I'm an ultimate player. Our host, Trae always says we need equity in everything. So I'm here to give you a window into conversations around equity in the world of Ultimate. I'm gonna try to stay out of the way as much as I can and let the player speak for themselves. But you'll hear my voice jump in here and there to give a little context or set up the story you're about to hear. We started out by asking the players about the weight they feel they carry when they speak about racial inequities in their sport.
Austin Hegmon 1:27
Yeah, I mean, it's part of it is like, we see things in a way that is different from the rest of the community. And I feel like it's the truth. Usually, when these sensitivities get brought up, it's by Black people that are in those spaces. I feel like since I'm afforded a platform, there's an inherent pressure on me to deliver on the things that people like are wanting me to talk about. And I think it's kind of stressful sometimes to feel like, Oh, I have to come up with a new way of saying this, or I have to go talk about something that seems like it's just common empathy.
Jay Matthews 2:06
Yeah I definitely feel you know, it's very frustrating, especially when I'm, like you said, We are usually the ones that make comments on the things we go through. And we're the ones that bring the weirdness out, because no one else are, unless you have like that melanin in your skin, you don't know what it feels like to be a person of color, you know. So every time we bring something, or we have a comment to share, it's always like, you know, we don't want to say too much. But like, at the same time, there's a lot to say about the topics and issues we go through. And we don't want to make it like we're complaining a lot. But the issues that we go through an ultimate just in the world in general, they're really serious topics and issues that we need to make other people aware about.
Colton Green 2:51
Yeah, I think, like, I notice what the ultimate community is, like, people like us, we point out both like problems and solutions, where I feel as like a lot of people in the ultimate space will just point out a problem. And then either won't address like the root of the problem, or they won't even like try and do it. They'll be like, well, we need more people of color. But we don't want to adjust our space to make it more welcoming for people of color. It's really easy for them to like, point out an issue. And then when people of color bring out real solutions they like either like don't listen, or they're like, No, I think this will work better. And I think like it shouldn't really be on us to be finding all the real solutions instead of just doing all the emotional labor.
Lili Gu 3:35
When it comes to the ultimate community in general, it's a pretty white space. And it's a space that generally proceeds itself as being very inclusive. We asked the players about their experience working to address the inequities of their sport in a culture built on white liberalism. That is players, teams and leagues wanting to seem woke without really being accountable for upholding racist structures.
Austin Hegmon 3:57
I see that a lot actually wouldn't. There's just like, shocked that people are like, that Black people have to deal with that on like a regular basis. Whereas the general sentiment I've noticed from a myself and be other people who play are like, a jaded, like, yeah, no shit, this happens.
Colton Green 4:15
Like we dealt with it every day. It's the selection of players, it like kind of like drives the narratives for the players, when you like, think about perspectives. It's like, ultimate is mainly played in like white high schools. And then like, where do most people like hosts their summer leaves? And it's like, mainly in like, wide areas. So it's like, when you don't even have ultimate players from those backgrounds. How are they supposed to speak up when they don't even know what the sport is?
Jay Matthews 4:42
You guys actually made me think of a story or not a story but an experience I had on the ultimate field. So it was my sophomore year, which was last year playing with Temple University and we had a tournament I don't remember where exactly it was, I think it might have been... Rutgers, I think is Rutgers main campus in New Brunswick. I'm pretty sure that's what it was. And we played NYU. Now I'm not here to - I'm not trying to expose any teams. But I am here to bring awareness to what these teams have done or how my experiences with playing with these teams have been. It was just one game we have with NYU, we started the game off nice and fresh. And you know, when someone picks up the disc, you're allowed to tap it in, if they're taking their time to tap it in. And I went and did that. And I would say NYU was majority white team. I think they were all white and probably had a few Asian people on their team. But there was not a person with dark skin on their team. And when I tapped the disk in, the girl just gave me full attitude she's like you're not allowed to do that. I'm just like, one, I am. And two, why are you giving me attitude? And for the rest of that game, that whole team has treated me so poorly, and all my teammates, and I'll tell you Temple University's team, we're pretty diverse we have, we had three Black women on the team, one just graduated, so just myself and another teammate, we have Indians on the team Filipinos and I will say the rest of the team is the majority white, but that's how it is an ultimate community. And my entire team, we're just pointing out J'Lynn, J'Lynn, why are they being so mean to you? And me, I didn't want to make any assumptions. And that kept saying, I don't really know. But in the back of my mind, I knew why. They thought I was an aggressive Black girl, or if it was racist at all, I don't know. But like, just those experiences on the field just kind of ruins the game a little bit. And it makes you think differently about that team, because the entire team ganged up on me after that it was literally the first point and I tapped the disk and like, that's allowed. Now, can I ask this question? If I was a white person, and I did tap that disk in, would she would have had the same reaction towards me after I did that? But yeah, it was insane. Because my whole team realized how bad that team was just treating me. And I would say, I'm not an aggressive player at all. I'm not aggressive. I talk to people in the field all the time, I compliment girls and their cleats and their socks and stuff. If they have a color and their hair, I always give my compliment. So just to have that team treat me so poorly, was like, it was an amazement to me, because I always loved NYU always thought it was a cool school. Until I played the team. And now I kind of have like a little, little hatred in my heart for that team, from that experience.
Colton Green 7:13
The thing, and ultimate is that like, what, like, why players like, they don't find offensive, they believe that like, just because they don't believe it's offensive. It isn't offensive, because like, say a person of color goes to like a board of a governing body, like, oh, someone said this to me. And I feel very uncomfortable saying it's like a majority white board. They're like, well, we don't think that's offensive. Whereas the person of color themselves, so they felt offended by it, they should listen to them. I think like one thing with the ultimate community like struggles with is like inclusion versus diversity. It's very easy to say like, we have a very diverse team. I was on a college team that was very diverse. But it wasn't a very inclusive environment for like the diverse people on the team. A lot of people in the ultimate community like diversity is what we need. And it's like, no need to create safe spaces for these people of color. Because like, we just don't want to bring players of color into a space where they will feel unwelcome and just gain more trauma and pain. Because we don't want to change our sport. Speaking to what Jay was saying, like Black players are more likely to be called like inspirited. Cuz like, same things happen to me. I've noticed that like, foul call discussions I've had with people have gotten more heated than when white players call things because it's like, I've won. I've won winter league Spirit Awards. It's not like I'm a spirited player, but there's like situations where like, people will see like, they're more likely to raise their voice when they're arguing with me or be like you don't know the rules. And I think there's a lot of untrained biases and I think that's something that like USAU can do because they have like quizzes for coaches. Like why not spend money on like bias training.
Lili Gu 8:52
For those unfamiliar with ultimate what Colton's talking about is the spirit of the game. It's kind of a formalized way of grading players on their sportsmanship. Also, since the sport is played without official referees, the players themselves are responsible for making sure the game is played safely and according to the rules in a white dominant sport. This ends up looking like codified racism. Jay's high school coach Chris Lehman wrote a series of op eds about this asking, What if the reason ultimate has remained so stubbornly White is unintentionally part of the very fabric of the game?
Austin Hegmon 9:25
Spirit of the game is a way to morally govern the players who play the game like it's essentially sportsmanship but ramped up to 10 and you get a score for it. But the score doesn't matter. It's just there. It's like, Oh, this person got rated a blank on the spirit score, that must mean that they're a good team to play for or against, and it's very arbitrary and in my opinion, very slanted towards why professionalism, as are most behaviors and ultimate wear if you aren't acting like how a white person, specifically a white man, if we're being honest here, like if you aren't acting how they would define proper since they are the people who invented the sport and invented this is code of conduct. If you aren't doing that or adhering to that, then you are going to have a low spirit score whether or not you're like a nice person or player or not.
Lili Gu 10:29
Now when they're talking about way back when ultimate was invented, keep in mind that's only 52 years ago. It's a young sport, and is always thought of itself as a hip liberal, inclusive bastion of community oriented athletes. But as these players have experienced, sometimes that self image can cloud the coach's ability to see the cracks within its own foundation.
Austin Hegmon 10:49
To your point about like a sport that prides itself on being inclusive. I feel like I've not been on a team so far where like they haven't like, emphasized that like, Oh, yeah, we are a team of people who are Yes, very inclusive and care about what's going on in the world other than my high school team who was pretty apolitical, like not even just to, like bring it to like a team thing. I still feel like I see a lot of people in today, January 2021, who are like, yeah, I am very much like about the liberation of Black like lives or whatnot. And then also do say and support things that don't hold up for that. And I've always been a pattern that I've noticed, at every level, the sport that I played on that people are going to tell you that they are very inclusive, whether they are or not. And it's pretty interesting to see how that plays out. And by interesting, I mean, genuinely disappointing.
Colton Green 11:55
Yeah, I mean, I went to the University of Texas at Dallas, I still go there. But when I when I was on the team, they were like, Oh, we think we're the most diverse team in the nation. But it was one of the most un-inclusive environments I had ever experienced, especially when the captains went from pretty diverse in leadership to when there was three all white captains then like the total thing change, because at least when we had a few, like people of color in charge, they're like, well, at least I know, somewhat what, like, the Black players are going through a little bit. Whereas like these white people have legit no clue. And then when I would express concerns, they would just walk over to them and be like, well, we don't think that the x person was being racist. Whenever I was adamant that this person was being racist with evidence, and I think it's like a thing. And ultimate is like, a lot of, I think especially like performative activism, because I think the sport is like, a driving point is that we want to make it welcome to everyone. And then when you however, when you make it to everyone that drives people away, you can't tolerate people who views oppress other people, you can't, you can't do that. I think people get lost, because they're like, well, these are our friends, or like, we really want to win. So we can't give up our star player. And I think that's an issue with the ultimate community is people are like too afraid to take stances, such as, like, the person who runs the biggest news outlet for ultimate, they feel that like, Oh, just because somebody has a certain views, they shouldn't be allowed on an actual team. I think that's part of the issues that like, our sport, will give platforms to people who they know, have hateful views. And they don't see an issue with that, because they're so focused on winning. And I think that it's been so long that ultimate keeps making excuses for people saying like, Oh, they just haven't learned yet. Whereas, like, players of color in that space already feel unsafe. And for these players just to keep hearing, well, they deserve a chance to learn where in this space is just very harmful. And it just takes a toll on people because you just keep getting told that Oh, they're not really racist when they've been being racist for years and they're not changing.
Austin Hegmon 14:27
I have one that's not as I feel like inherently harmful, I guess, quote, unquote, in the sense that Colton is talking about, but I feel like it is still indicative and it is related specifically to the game that we play, where you see a lot of like people of color, a getting pigeonholed into roles that people think that people of color would do if they were in an athletic space. Like for instance, you see Black people as big powerful like cutters, cutters being like that - essentially like a wide receiver kind of deal. Or like an Asian person being like a squirrely, like, quick reset handler where they like, how are the safety valve and they have to get the disc back because all they are is quick, or whatever. And I think that I think that those types of views, while not explicitly harmful, even in the way that like, Colton meant where, yes, these views are really not great. I feel like adhering to those stereotypes is something that happens in frisbee far too often. And something that is indicative of a bigger picture of how frisbee players view like inclusivity and diversity and all that.
Jay Matthews 15:50
Well, I'll be quite honest with you guys. I know. My experiences as a Black woman is very different as you guys experience as Black men coming from a city like Philadelphia, which is very diverse in our population. Things don't go down that much that has to do with race because we have such a significant like community that will back everyone up. thing my high school is actually in Center City of Philadelphia is our back like our backyard was skyscrapers and stuff. I'll also tell you my high school was very small art. We had a total of like 500 students who did not have a gym. The whole school was our gym, we would run stairs, workout in the cafeteria and stuff and I will say that frisbee ultimate was our football we didn't have a football team ultimate was our football team. The majority of our population, our high school, you know, came out to our ultimate games they played with us. Our principal was actually the coach of our ultimate team Chris Lehman. And we did have two ultimate teams are kind of three we had a girls team and then we had a boys varsity and a boys JV as well. The demographics of the Frisbee team were majority Black, it was more you know, Black people play and then white people. So like I said, playing on the girls team. We didn't run into many issues in high school. But our guys seemed it like I said, we're majority Black. We played suburban teams and those suburban teams were majority white. You play schools like Radner, Loren Merion. And Pennsbury. Pennsbury was actually a very difficult team for both girls and guys team to play because they were like, I can't, I don't know how to like sum this down. But like, I just have to say they were really racist team. Now the girls team, they were just kind of mean, I wouldn't say they were really racist, but the guys team they were, they said some horrible things to our men players, they would do horrible things to our men players, and not just the players themselves, but the coaches as well. And their family, they will be on the sideline like they will put our guys team through hell kind of and all we wanted to do was just get out there and play ultimate, you know, which is the sad part. So like I say, my experiences as a female playing is not the same as you know, my male friends. And like I hate to say that's how it is. You guys definitely go through much more than what we go through.
Colton Green 18:11
Yeah, and I think one thing, from like, a USAU perspective, which is USAU is the governing body - is they make it really, really hard for high school teams, if you want to play and you don't have a high school at your team. I mean, you don't have a you don't have a team at your high school. And they make it really difficult for you to play in state championships. And they do that as we want to legitimate state championship. Well, it's like, well, what do you gain out of that? There's a bunch of hoops that you have to jump through, if you want to play at a different school. There's no money prize, there's nothing significant from winning. And like, the only thing that accomplishes is not letting people play. Because I know in Dallas, most of the white schools like have sustained people over the years and the more like teams where there's diversity, like they have been like less consistent. So it'd be like super helpful for those teams that are like, have a down year to be able to like say combined with another team and play state. But like you say you're so focused that they don't want to do that. Think like another issue like USAU can do is like help subsidize coaches that want to like coach in like the inner city because like, whenever I've talked to people and asked like, why don't you coach like, well, I would rather coach at this majority white school because it's like closer to me. And it's the easy way out. I think that like they could be spending money to be like, here's like the gas money like go invest in these communities. And I think you say you could also be putting money towards like, hosting more events and like these like communities of color, have something that we've talked about Dallas is like this thing called color of ultimate where they have a game where it's majority players of color, and I think something great about that as like you could host that in like an area where they usually don't have ultimate and it's like, what my high school coach he works in like the Dallas like Parks and Rec and he noticed a difference between when showing like Ultimate highlights with people who they like, it's just white people, they're like, man, these people are like me. And then when I show highlights with players of color, they're like, wow, like that could like actually be me making those plays. I think that's like, a big like thing for like, kids trying to play ultimate is like to see representation.
Austin Hegmon 20:16
One thing that I've noticed living in Atlanta is that a lot of like, elite level players will eventually go into one of like our cities to play and to likely help participate in gentrifying the city as a whole. But in the terms of ultimate, they will come. And they will either play, and they'll want to coach, but they'll only do it with the elite level, mostly white colleges and high schools in the area, which in turn creates a even bigger gaps in the resources that areas where people of color are playing ultimate. And like the areas where white people are playing ultimate, and it feels like that is one of the biggest reasons I've noticed that people of color are being pushed away from the sport because without adequate resources and adequate coaching, these people are going to just lose and give up playing because you're playing against people who are elite level like players. And the gap keeps getting bigger because those people are being coached by other elite players is very frustrating because it's caused me to see a lot of my friends leave the sport due to general frustration.
Colton Green 21:43
I think like one thing that leads to is like, how like clickiness and like frisbee is tied is that like, those players who are coached by those elite players will have better opportunities to play because like, say they plan to lead team in the city, they can be like, oh, come to one of our elite club practices. or whenever they go to practices, they're like, well, we can either take this kid, or this, this kid knows the coach, like his coach plays on our team. It's basically like connections and I think a lot more connections come out from that. So it's just like makes the disadvantage people like already more disadvantage that these elite players are like, spending all their time and energy on like the people that don't really like need it.
Austin Hegmon 22:26
One thing that I would like to account for is that like frisbee you don't get to pick where you go to school based on where you like playing frisbee a lot of the time unless you were very fortunate and very privileged to do so which in fairness, a lot of frisbee players are but or overwhelming majority of players even amongst like a white middle class sport, like you're going to go to the college that like you're just get into based on like solely academics. And when you go to like at Georgia State, or like, I'm trying to think of one in Texas, like a school, Ross University or something, the opportunity is going to be a lot more limited right off the bat than you would if you went to like a Carleton or a University of Georgia or a University of Texas or a University of Pittsburgh. I don't know how to like, or I know how to change if you just get more people to those areas. But I don't know how exactly to motivate people to do it, I guess which is frustrating.
Lili Gu 23:32
Another topic that came up was this idea of appropriation of Black culture by non Black players, spectators and members of the ultimate community.
Colton Green 23:39
It's a predominantly white sport that loves to appropriate Black culture in many ways. And I'm not not not a fan of that. Like ultimate was like designed for white people and white people that when you see white people running around appropriating Black culture on the sidelines through music, hairstyles, jerseys, all these language it’s very, very… it turns a lot of people off.
Austin Hegmon 24:07
It's very interesting to see like USA ultimate for example or whoever be like have this have these like equity commercials of like yeah, we're all unified. We are all standing up for this that and the third and then you go to like a highlight reel of some college like tournament in Myrtle Beach or wherever you see some white guy on UNC Wilmington put like cornrows... I think everything that we've done so far for the sport has been like devoid of organic Black culture, if that makes sense because I feel like occasionally you do see like Black culture in frisbee, but it's always like Colton said gone through the channel of like, a bunch of weird white people from like, St. Louis or some town not pick on St. Louis or anything but like, you see a bunch of dudes from like Colorado like talking about it. And it's just not the same as like, when it happens through Black people and through organic like means of communication and very apparent when it happens. It feels very even when Black culture is in the sport. It feels white washed.
Colton Green 25:20
It kind of feels like white people like made him do it. Yeah. Like it was like, oh, white person made it. It was like, I need you to say this rather than like, the Black player was like, This is what I wanted to say.
Austin Hegmon 25:34
Yeah, one thing that like I have always been on the idea of like, yeah, we need more people of color in highlight songs because I feel like as of right now, highlights are how we market the sport the best to people who don't play we show people highlights of people who were trying to get involved in the sport. And I don't know, it's just really weird to see like, a bunch of white dudes all the time playing a sport with like this white dubstep artists from Europe with like six vowels in his name as the artist in like, I don't know, I've shown it to people as an experiment showed it to my Black friends who have either quit first view or have been like, Oh, you play frisbee? What is that? Like? And I'll show them like that as like, one of the videos and they'll be like, Oh, shit, does not look fun. Like, this doesn't look like anything I would be into. And yeah, you see a bunch of white people running around with white culture all the time. And when Black culture is there, it's very much like bastardized, it really hinders, I think the growth of the sport, or Black people and for POCs in an organic way.
Jay Matthews 26:48
I was just thinking about like, representation of people of color and ultimate, you know, like, whenever you think of a person of color, ultimately, first person I think of as a Black man ultimate is, um, Marcus Bromley as like the first person that picture in my head, but you know, you know a bunch of white people's names and ultimate like Bo Kinja, you know, Brody Smith, who barely plays ultimate, but like he's out there, Dylan Freechild, you just know a bunch of bunch of their names. But when I like, you know, Kalief, obviously from Mixtape and Gabriel Hernandez and stuff like you, those are few names that I only know from my involvement of the Twitter ultimate community. But whenever I'm on USAU or any other website, ulti-world and all of that stuff that you know, there are the main ultimate platforms, you barely see those names. You barely see those names advertised. And I'm just questioning the representation of people of color and ultimate. You know, we love that those, those little tournaments and games and stuff but like other than those tournaments, yeah the color ofultimate, other than that, what else are we doing as a whole for the ultimate community to make it more diverse and show representation for you know, more people of color?
Lili Gu 27:57
Speaking of changing the sport and bringing more Black players into ultimate, we asked Jay Austin and Colton about the all Black tour that Shanye announced in last week's interview. If you missed the conversation, or just need a refresher, the idea is to put together teams of all Black players to play showcase games across the country. In ultimate, it's a rare equity themed project that doesn't ladder up to white leadership or power. Here's what Austin Colton and Jay had to say about it.
Austin Hegmon 28:21
Yeah, I applied, I should be going to the Philadelphia one, which is in the fall, I can't speak for anyone else. But I'm incredibly excited for it as like someone that I feel like has not been afforded a lot of the opportunities that even other players of color have received on more elite level programs. I am very excited just to like have a community where I feel like 100% safe and feel very free to speak and act how I normally would speak.
Colton Green 29:01
Yeah, I'm super excited. Still don't know what city. I love to see that all these Black players are being afforded opportunities that they just normally aren't like, I am privileged enough that I am on professional ADL Dallas roughnecks team and like most Black players, like don't even have like opportunities like that, like they won't even can't even like afford tryouts and the fact that like, these games are most likely to be streamed and they can make plays. And just be given a platform where it's like, about them is like so big because like often and ultimate like players of color, just like kind of just like put aside or it's like they're not really highlighted. They're like, well, we're just going to put you on defense and you're going to do your job. And just the fact that like they're able to be highlighted in the show their skills is gonna be super, super incredible. I'm really excited for it. Yeah,
Jay Matthews 29:54
I'm applying as well. I can't wait obviously I'm doing Philly. Can't go too far. Every time you see like the highlight reel of ultimate games, especially like from a UDL, they always like try to like squeeze in like the people of color and your amazing plays. And I'm just like this person is dominating. And like you say you play for the Roughnecks, and I have friends that play for Philadelphia, Phoenix and stuff. And I'm just like, you guys are dominating. I'm so proud of you. And unfortunately, like your season was just canceled because of, you know, the pandemic and everything. And I just hope like next season for you guys is amazing. Like, I just want you guys to showcase all your talent as much as you can. Because like, I always say it is to my friends. I'm just like, if ultimate wasn't like primarily white, and if like we did have more people of color in this sport, I always say like we would dominate so much, because we just bring so much talent to the game. There's just so much. I love it.
Lili Gu 30:51
All three of these athletes are putting their time and energy towards helping make the sport they love more equitable. And so we were curious what brought them to ultimate in the first place.
Austin Hegmon 31:00
I've always been like, competitive and like athletic. And, yeah, I've always looked up to people in other sports, like, trying to think of like Ocho Cinco, or Allen Iverson or other people like that in the like, mid 2000s, Hot Sauce, all these dudes that I've seen just out here balling at what they've been doing. And I've always wanted that to be me, playing something, doing something active and being really good at it. And it's outside of the last hour of conversation like I do enjoy playing the sport. I just want to have fun doing what I'm doing. And I think that's kind of what I've adopted for most things in my life at 24. As of right now in frisbee is still a very fun thing to do. And if I can find something that I find a team or an outlet that I can continue to grow with. That is my only goal.
Colton Green 32:04
I first started playing because I love sports. But I happen to be terrible at other sports, and I mean, I fell in love with frisbee is just like super fun. And like I've met a lot of like great friends. And then some other experiences and ultimate like hasn't been great. I guess like when I first started playing ultimate, my goal is like to make a professional team. So I've made already reached my goal with the fighter 20. But I guess like now like my main thing is just like coaching, giving back. I was afforded a lot of opportunities by having great coaches. So I want to like give people that usually like don't have the opportunity, like people who don't have elite culture coaches to like have someone who like will care and like, teach them how to play and Yeah,
Jay Matthews 32:56
Like I said, I first started playing ultimate my freshman year of high school, and I will be honest, I've never played a sport in my entire life. And so my freshman year of high school ultimate was the first whatever blade It was great because ultimately the easiest sport to play, you know, and the people that introduced me to it was my principal Chris Lehman and and the girls coach at the time her name was Robin Echols. She was an amazing coach. Now they're being coached by stuffs so she's also she's awesome as well. Like I said ultimate was just really fun for me. I felt like it was an escape for me like never being able to play a sport before. And in finding something that I had a passion for. It was just amazing. It was like my getaway. We had 6:30am practices Mondays and Thursdays right before school, our school didn't have any showers By the way, but I woke up every morning, loving it loving what I did loving practice loving after school games, loving tournament's over the weekends and stuff and things. I hope that change and ultimate community like Colton said he is playing professional ultimate, I will love to also play professional ultimate. But you know, the ADL doesn't have, you know, a women's section yet. So that's something I'm looking forward to. I'm also hoping for the better in our ultimate community, as you know, for the world is like more diversity, more inclusion and stuff. And at the moment, like I said, I do you serve on a board of Patta. My role is college team relations, but I also serve on the committee. So like, at the moment, I'm trying my best to help out with that to make it more inclusive and more out there for us.
Lili Gu 34:27
And right as we were wrapping up, Austin brought up one last point.
Austin Hegmon 34:30
Oh, I do have one more actual like thing to say, among people specifically, where I feel like there are a lot of ultimate players who are making strides to be more equitable to the players that are on their teams and the players that are playing against them and just the people in the ultimate community and it's not enough. If you are only being equitable to the people in your circle. You are not actually being equitable.
Colton Green 35:00
Yeah, I think it's a lot easier for people to say they don't have general biases, because like, I have all my best friend is Black, and they don't say anything. Whereas like, they might treat other people of color terribly. So I think it's, it's very important to like take a step back and not blinded by like, Oh, I have friends that are people of color and be like, what am I actually doing to like, make my friends feel safe and welcome.
Jay Matthews 35:27
I find that very interesting, because you have to hold everyone accountable. Of course, the temples, men's team is actually the whole team is white and is one asian guy, which I find hilarious. But they they took a stance door, and in June and everything, they took a stance and they realized they acknowledge that the school they go to is in a Black neighborhood in Philadelphia is in North Philadelphia. And they are like, we need to, you know, give back to our community. everything that's going on right now is not okay. And we are aware, and we realized that, but they've taken multiple initiatives to make sure to give back to the community help the community, they've sent people to schools, some teammates got together and went to local elementary schools around he taught somebody kids how to play ultimate. And those elementary schools are primarily Black, you know, students there. So they, they've been trying their best to, you know, hold everybody accountable and give back to the community. There's also some people on our team that they've had, that, you know, had different, different political views as well. And they made sure that I don't think they've changed their political views. If they had those views. They had them for a reason. But the team made it aware to them that listen, just because you have these views, we have to treat everyone This way, like the same. We can't, you know, be too loud or outspoken about those views. We know like everyone has freedom to speech and everything. But this is our team core values, and you have to follow them if you want to continue to be on a team. I don't think they had any incidents with that person or any other people who had different political views, but they took it stance as a whole team together and made sure everybody was on the same page.
Lili Gu 37:00
So that's it for our conversation with Jay Matthews, Austin Hegmon, and Colton Green. Thank you so much to these three beautiful people and athletes for sharing their time with us. We at Equity Rising are rooting for you wherever you go in ultimate and in life. This episode was produced by myself, Lily Gu, and Julia Drachman, Linnea Ingalls, and Josh Berl, with support from Kayla Imrisek and Laura Cassidy. Thank you for listening. And we'll be back next week with another traditional episode of Equity Rising with our amazing hosts Trae Holiday. Take care!